The game of evolution - Free Chat, Mobile Dating Forums

Topic: The game of evolution

Narlycarnk

Tue 05/08/18 06:14 PM

In the US there is a new wave of many people who do not want to have kids or even spouses. People are good but there is a condition of overcrowding and that is reducing quality of life. Overcrowding disrupts the harmony of community. There is no access to solitude, so people cannot unplug from the organization and have time to have original thought on their own. People need that balance, because community should be made of people who want to be together, not who have to. People have walls up, for good reason, but as a result never get to open up for a deep and loyal relationship. Instead of people being lonely and wanting to interact, they are fearful and there are random acts of violence, disorder, and chaos. Many people do not want to bring kids into the world because of an increasingly bleak feature for them, and knowing that they would also be contributing to overpopulation. There are opportunists and strategist. The opportunities have many kids and many of them die a wasteful death. The strategists work together with language and strategy as a family and as a community to ensure the fitness and success of their community. Each person has a place and a sense of belonging. If they reproduce it is out of duty not greed. Strategic community can involve all people in some way, but OVERcrowding is not for the good of all people. The question is, how do WE win the game of evolution?

The Wrong Alice

Tue 05/08/18 10:17 PM

You don't try. Evolution is not game and thus cannot be won.

Tom4Uhere

Tue 05/08/18 11:06 PM

The question is, how do WE win the game of evolution?

LOL, hahaha, LOL

Obviously you are not sure what evolution actually is?

Evolution takes many generations to see any change at all and on one generation will ever be able to look and say "Look, we are evolving" LOL.

For any significant evolutionary change to happen requires a significant environmental change. It could be a change in environment or a change in species normalcy but it won't make an evolutionary physical change in one or two generations.

Think about it. Homo-sapiens have been this 'form' for around 2 million years. By comparison, alligators have been alligators for 30-50 Million years. Sharks are about 450 Million years old. Bacteria have been evolving for around 3.5 BILLION years. At 2 million years, we haven't even reached a stabilized body type.
Its more likely we will wink out like may other 'failed' types. Its just too early to tell.
I mean, dinosaurs, now extinct 65 million years first came on the scene around 250 Million years ago. That's about a 200 Million year evolutionary history and even they went extinct.

Many people think that the year 2479 is a long time from now. Think 24,079,000 years from now. That is only 24 million years. Not even half of the time alligators have been evolving.

Just think of what we might become in 1 million, 10 million, 100 million years? That is evolution.
In 100 Million years from now, the Sun will still be in main sequence. The Earth will still be in the Goldilocks zone. The Moon, while orbiting at a larger distance will will be orbiting. Our air will have less oxygen. The magnetosphere might be a bit weaker but the Earth will still support life.

Along about 3 BILLION years from now. The Sun will be sluffing off its outer layers. The water will boil away and Earth will no longer be able to support life. By that time, if humans still exist, we will have long since left this world.

Evolution...pffft.

ciretom

Wed 05/09/18 07:55 AM

how do WE win the game of evolution?

Absolutely define "human being," then kill off anything with non human DNA?
At the same time (or before) figure out a means for perpetual absolute immortality, and to create and control infinite energy, infinite mass, and infinite space?

Narlycarnk

Wed 05/09/18 04:32 PM

A group of people could adapt one way or another way, and become like an owl or like a chicken. Right now we are amidst a crowded cluster of primate. Evolution works by building a diverse gene pool and then selecting a subgroup to adapt to a way of life. This is done by environmental selection survival, sexual selection, and social selection. There is not that so much a difference in peoples DNA, but some people’s DNA have definite defects and it is not to their advantage to have kids of their own. On the other hand, there have been times in history when more than half of the career driven people and society did not have children because it did not see their lifestyle, back when people did not know about evolution. I think if a subgroup of people colonized wilderness, they could adapt to something more lifelike, more than just a persistent surviving jellyfish.

Narlycarnk

Wed 05/09/18 04:39 PM

The farmers work evolution pretty well with their vegetable cultivars. I think it is better if things are more wild though, with a relationship with the environment and other species in the ecosystem.

The Wrong Alice

Wed 05/09/18 05:40 PM

One species of jellyfish, can reproduce it's own cells so in theory lives forever.... If dolphins were monkeys that came from the land, soon I'll be walking the beach holding your hand( lyrics courtesy of ian brown, regarding the theory that dolphins moved onto the land, didn't like what they found, so went back to the sea, clever dolphins)

Edited by The Wrong Alice on Wed 05/09/18 05:40 PM

Tom4Uhere

Wed 05/09/18 06:42 PM

I guess you could look at bio-engineering as a form of evolution?

The thing about natural evolution is that many times a species diversion of form happens but cannot survive time.
Our fossil records shows some of the diversity of evolution but doesn't show the traits that the species used to survive or fall extinct.

Could there have been a dinosaur species version that developed intelligence? I think so, but something caused that diversion to go extinct.
Could there be a talking ape? Could happen...
Might there have been a race of ancestral human beings that progressed faster and smarter than our current form? Is there a lost history that predates the discovery record?
Might there be people alive right now that have super-human abilities compared to the common model of homo sapiens? I doubt there are X-Men type people but there are highly intelligent and highly healthy individuals.

If we one day become smart enough to successfully bio-engineer our bodies for application, will those bio-engineered examples survive time and multiply or will they genetically become extinct due to some natural but currently unknown condition.

As far as I know, there is nobody on this planet alive today that is a pristine genetic edition. We are all mixed heritage. That mixology of genetic code could be considered an evolutionary strand. Our heritage is becoming something new as a species.

Starting out with multiple genetic baselines and mixing into one baseline that we have not seen yet.
When our species becomes one baseline, will it survive or go extinct?

The Wrong Alice

Sat 05/12/18 04:34 AM

are we in fact evolved, who decides

ttrockz

Sat 05/12/18 05:14 AM

I just watched First People on Prime. Very informative. One of it's big messages was that the Nomads didn't just disappear, but were assimilated by the "modern human". So, there is evolution, Their tracings of history show humans lived in groups and interacted with other groups. Learned, grew and evolved by doing so.

The Wrong Alice

Sat 05/12/18 07:33 AM

Whilst on the one hand I agree with you, on the other I wonder if humans are really evolved at all perhaps I'm confusing it with civilised, I can't think of another species that reaps so much havoc on poor old mother nature whome I consider to be evolution to some degree, she must be tutting and shaking her head

Tom4Uhere

Sat 05/12/18 11:18 AM

Humans are evolving right now, we just don't notice the evolutionary change because it happens very slowly and very subtly.
Our minds are evolving at a faster rate than our bodies.
We are changing our environmental conditions faster than our bodies can keep up.
There will be a point where our civilized technology may exceed our body's ability to compensate.
We will in essence be forced to live inside a bubble.
In a way, we are already entering that stage of our evolution.
We live in climate control, protected from the natural elements.
Right now, we can venture into nature and still survive but there may come a time where we can't survive nature.
You drop an unprotected human on nearly any part of the planet and nature will kill them. We have a limited zone of survivability, where its not too hot, not too cold.
Think sunburns, frostbite, viruses and diseases.
We have isolated ourselves from our environment and will continue to do so at ever increasing rates.
Humans survived the Ice Age because our bodies evolved with the climate.
We are still in the most current ice age but we are coming out of it.
Its going to get a lot warmer before it gets cooler again.
Problem is, we are insulated from the evolutionary changes more and more.
We are using climate control because it makes us feel comfortable right now.

The Wrong Alice

Sat 05/12/18 01:01 PM

I don't think humans survived the ice age fella. And while I agree with a lot you say, I believe we have to learn to co exist in harmony with nature, not destroy her. If we could manage that then maybe we may be able to consider ourselves evolved or civilised. otherwise evolution will simply evolve again and we may not be part of it, which I think would be pretty fair really. The human race constantly disappoints me. And while I try to look on the bright side, if I try to remain objective what would mother nature really think of us. Would she think we were worthy of sticking around for another millennia. I know this may not happen anyway regardless of our actions and I hope I haven't strayed to far of the topic. I don't think evolution can be won as I've previously stated. But are we deserving of evolution, I think may perhaps be the question. Anyway food for thought.

Tom4Uhere

Sat 05/12/18 02:24 PM

I don't think humans survived the ice age fella.

You do know we are still in an ice age, right?

consider ourselves evolved or civilised

You are aware that evolution is not the same as civilization, right?

evolution will simply evolve again

Evolution in not a single act or event, it is a continuous adaptation to environments.
It involves adaption in physical, behavioral and intellectual parameters.

what would mother nature really think of us

Mother Nature is a fantasy, Nature is just Reality.
Reality doesn't think, doesn't consider specific species and has no agenda, it just is. Reality doesn't care either way because it doesn't care, it just is.

Evolution isn't a right, isn't a race, has no prize.
Evolution is change from one baseline to another over time.
The only way to stop evolving is to freeze yourself or die.
Even if you were to leave the planet you would still evolve, but you would evolve to conditions different than found on this planet.

Anyway food for thought.

Yes, fantasy can be food for thought but it is still fantasy.

Narlycarnk

Sat 05/12/18 02:42 PM

Yes, R2, I agree, I think it would be good to evolve to keep harmony with nature, even if it does take millions of years. When I say WE win the game of evolution, I mean as a whole community, including all living things, evolve in a way that is for a greater purpose, for our own good. Thanks for your thoughts.

iam_resurrected

Sat 05/12/18 02:56 PM

first of all, you have to control natural selection and inherited traits. if you actually understood DNA, you would see evidence of higher knowledge within the simulation of hominids. DNA proves the possibility of randomness to be inaccurate.

but then again, after 150+ years under the microscope testing single cell samples, not one time has any split and divided to become a new species. it literally took biologist playing God to achieve this process.

so my suggestion is simple, until single cell actually divides and splits on its own, your topic is mute.

let's be honest here...of all single cell test samples examined, there would have had to been some nearing the process of splitting and dividing. and 150+ years watching them under the microspore proves this process has yet to take place. and no way should we assume all single cell samples used are similar in age.

but like the biologist who played God and created their own hypothesis, hominids are capable of controlling overpopulation via abortion and euthanasia. and neither of those processes require evolving!!

Edited by iam_resurrected on Sat 05/12/18 03:01 PM

Tom4Uhere

Sat 05/12/18 03:30 PM

Everything an organism is exposed to is part of the evolving process.
Thing is, the process is very very minute and is only noticed after a significant change from baseline manifests.

In that humans affect their environment we are causing certain types of evolution to manifest earlier than nature would.

For example, exposing our young to certain technology allows them to mature at a different rate.
Eating healthier and properly exercising is causing humans to live longer.
These evolutionary changes can be tracked within a few generations.
Four year olds today are more intelligent and coordinated than four year olds a century ago.
Forty year olds are healthier than forty year olds a century ago.

These changes are causing evolutionary change in our physiology as well but not so noticeable. Are zygotes developing brain function during an earlier time in gestation? Have we even looked? Could we know if a change was occurring if we have no baseline data to track such a change?

The baseline human form doesn't seem to change much in the last million or so years, that we can tell by looking. We can't look at skeletons and determine if there has been a change in oxygenation as the atmosphere's oxygen saturation wanes over time.
We can't look at paintings and determine if skin had less natural Sun block than our current form as the Sun gets progressively stronger because we have changed the filtering aspects of our atmosphere thru pollution.
We base our understanding on the evidence we collect from records and fossil records. If we are not looking at one aspect or another, we are not gaining perspective of the subtle evolutionary changes that might be present.

Evolution is happening constantly.
Did you spend the day sun bathing, in the house under cover?
Insignificant constant changes build up over time.
Like going from complete darkness to full Sun.
Hurts the eyes because your eyes evolved to focus in low light.
Now, ramp that up to living in the dark of a cave for years then going out in full sunlight. That is evolution in a single lifetime that is significant.

iam_resurrected

Sat 05/12/18 03:48 PM

first of all, excellent response.

but now I must ask the question that will give me more insight to what you actually believe pertaining science and its definitive theories...

the keyboard your fingers manipulated to format words by pressing the selective lettered keys, did your fingers [energy] actually make contact with your keyboard [energy] in order to create your last post?

Tom4Uhere

Sat 05/12/18 04:05 PM

the keyboard your fingers manipulated to format words by pressing the selective lettered keys, did your fingers [energy] actually make contact with your keyboard [energy] in order to create your last post?

Scientifically...NO
The nuclear force is repulsive, keeping the protons and neutrons from getting too close to one another.

However, relatively...YES

The same reason why my hand doesn't pass thru my desk.
There are four forces (Electromagnetic, Strong, Weak, and Gravity) that are responsible for the behavior of the particles and thus keep the atom together.

Then you have quantum fields that act in a different nature.
The modern (perturbative) quantum mechanical view of the fundamental forces other than gravity is that particles of matter (fermions) do not directly interact with each other, but rather carry a charge, and exchange virtual particles (gauge bosons), which are the interaction carriers or force mediators.

Now, here is something that you may not have considered....
What if I composed and posted my response with "speech to text software" and I don't even have a keyboard?
What if I dictated my response verbally to someone via phone who is at a different location and they typed it and posted it using my name?

iam_resurrected

Sat 05/12/18 04:17 PM

true enough.

do you follow Arizona States Krause, who claims, "after evidence of the COBE telescope, it provides evidence the Bang happened, and as result of the Bang the laws of physics took in effect?"

this eradicates the prior BBT all together.

it also leads to a soup theory.

also sort of helps Neil's [Tyson DeGrasse] latest proposal, of us living in a simulated universe with higher knowledge [aliens - or God] setting the stage.

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