Michael Moore and Bernie Sanders has one thing in common, they seems to love socialism. Look to Norway, the richest and happiest country in the world, they say. That’s how a society should be, that’s socialism in practice!

When selecting facts that suits their view and ignore facts that don't, then Norway is really great.

I know there has been a big discussion about healthcare in US the recent years. Therefore some US politicians use Norway as an example of free healthcare.

In Norway there has been “free” healthcare for more than fifty years. But is it really free? Does someone really think nurses and doctors work for free? And hospitals rise up from the ground by it selves? The money has to come from somewhere. And in Norway that somewhere is from two main sources; taxes and oil!

Income tax upwards to 48%, tax on goods and products somewhere between 25% and up to 150% for some products like alcohol, tobacco and cars. $400 a year just to have a car registered, $7 per gallon of gas, $3 to $20 passing thru a toll booth (“toll” is a Norwegian word btw) around every major city centers and many bridges and tunnels. Driving from Moss to Larvik (two small towns south of Oslo, about 40mi distance) cost no less than $34 one way! A glass of beer is $9 and upwards. A house outside a city starts at $300.000. In Oslo you only get a small apartment for that. A Golf 1.4l entry level cost about $35.000 and up to $100.000. Yes, for a VW Golf! These are just few examples of how we pay for “free” healthcare in Norway. And don’t forget that oil income is a BIG contributor to everything “free” in Norway. Without it we would have paid even more!

Does Americans in general know how expensive “free” healthcare really is? Does Bernie Sanders and other politicians tell you this?

So, it’s not free. But is it any good? It’s not bad nor good. Most doctors do a good job, but waiting time for surgery can be months and in some cases years. The hospitals are sometimes old and need rehabilitation. There are sometimes few hospital beds and sometimes you will lay in a bed in a hallway in lack off rooms. I would rather pay less in tax and more for insurance so I could choose for my self what is the best healthcare for me and my family. In Norway the government choose that for you, if you like it or not.

The problem with socialism is everyone isn't paying into the system. Some won't work at all, just a very expensive baby factory. Some healthy people claim to be disabled. So tax payers are already funding free healthcare.
It's time to stop punishing people for being productive. I think anything over 40 hours in a work week shouldn't be taxed at all. Some people are going above and beyond to contribute to society while some are leeches. We need a balance. Free healthcare for all should only be considered if it comes with a full time job for all.

Some countries force people to work. If we are wanting to be like other countries, that's where we should start.

People being irresponsible with money isn't an excuse to sit on welfare. Inheritance is worked for by the parents and a lot of times by the kids. I worked overtime at my job this week and have spent my time off working on rental property. My kids who will inherit the property also worked on it too. My son took vacation days to help.

Kids who are raised by irresponsible parents grow up thinking things should be handed to them. My kids have learned to have a work ethic and to keep a nice home. They are acquiring problem solving skills.

I apprecite what you are saying about *your* thoughts and experiences...
But people in the Scandinavian countries and most of Europe report a higher life satisfaction...they don't seem to be mad about the taxes..



https://news.gallup.com/opinion/gallup/206468/happiest-unhappiest-countries-world.aspx

The problem with socialism is everyone isn't paying into the system. Some won't work at all, just a very expensive baby factory. Some healthy people claim to be disabled.

No system will be perfect. Some people wont work. Some people in need wont work, and others with more resources than they could ever need, that THEY did not 'work' for (family money, inheritance, windfalls, investments) will not 'work' either.

we will have no system that guarantees everyone 'works'.

It's a good question. And there's not an easy answer to that. I know a lot of people in Scandinavia and Germany and a few other countries report about good life quality and happiness. What's not clear, and that is VERY true for Norway, is _why_ so many are happy.

I don't know US in every detail, but I know that people without jobs do have a rough life. Many have no home and struggle just to get food every day. I don't think those people would report about very good life quality. Don't you agree?

And of course there are people without jobs here too (in fact, very many of them). But in Norway and Scandinavia they don’t have to live on the streets. Actually, every single Norwegian is _entitled_ to a home, clothes, food and everything they need from day to day. In some cases there is more profitable not working. It’s not difficult to understand why most of these people report about a ok life. Don’t you agree?

So the big question is how much would you as a worker pay for other people that don’t work? Most of us (me too) will not accept to see people living on the street and have a miserable life. But when some people get more money than people with full time jobs? When there are too many cases like this, people start asking questions.

In Norway the official numbers are 4% unemployment, among the lowest in Europe. But the Norwegian politicians came up with a clever plan. What if we only count people that are temporary unemployed and call all the rest something else? About 600.000 people without a job are categorized with different health issues, drug abuse and other socially obstacles. Pretending there’s a low unemployment rate will never solve the problems.

I believe the reasoning behind the suppling of basics there in the Scandinavian coutries is because THAT is cheaper in the lonbg run that NOT doing so...(does that make sense?)

Like, paying people in this country enough so someone who works full time still needs/ qualifies for food stamps..and having free health care instead of poor people going to the ER and not being able to pay the bills(meaning, hospitals have to write that money off/ roll it into costs to other people) would actually *save* money in the long run...

All those people who gave up looking for jobs...or were downsized or eliminated because of their age (ageism is rampant here in the job market)...
They don't figure into the actual unemployed statistics...which would be *far* higher if they did.