Most people don't think of the impact our species population has on our personal lives.
Some know but don't take it seriously.

Lets explore how overpopulation affects our personl lives.

Most will argue, complain and fight about government politics but the real issues, the ones that will change our actual quality of life are sadly ignored.

Here's a chance to think about how humans are impacting our own sustainability and the planet itself.

http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/
World Population Clock

A few weeks ago I posted this screenshot



I JUST took this screenshot



This is significant.

Edit: the today figures is insignificant because clockwise, today just started.

Well I did mention in a thread not that long ago that humans could cut their carbon footprint in half, all we have to do is get rid of half the population. Half now or all will be wiped out later, take your pick. This could be done by cutting birth rates, natural selection, or any number of other ways. Sooner or later nature will do it for us. The US economy depends on an increase in people to keep it going. That's why the government gives tax credits for children, and continues to take in immigrants. Thing is we are all just a speck in time so we are only concerned about the here and now, chances are we all will be long gone by the time things get wiped out, of coarse it could be an asteroid or volcano tomorrow that wipes us out, but we ain't go'n do much bout that now are we?

Well unfortunately we have mismanaged pretty much everything else on this planet..So now
Why would we start with population..
We are a reactionary species.. not a forward-thinking species.. for the most part.. we all like to think that there's somebody in charge! somebody at the Helm of the ship... but really the people that are in charge or just making it up as they go along.... kind of like the movie industry..
Every movie from the beginning of movie making has built on the movies that have come before it... it's a learning process...

Now you would think you make a bad movie no big deal!.. and you would be right!!
You wouldn't sell any tickets... but unfortunately in this day and age you can make a bad movie and then still make another bad movie right after it.. and people will still pay to go see it... look how many actors that have made bad movies one after the another are still acting... Vin Diese...or the rock... but we keep buying tickets and popcorn...why?... because it's the only game in town... and they know it..

The only difference is you make a bad movie nobody gets killed.. you make the wrong decision for a planet everybody gets killed.... so you would think there would be some real thought put into it wouldn't you.. from how we treat each other.. how we feed everyone how we house everyone...
Some real sustainable thinking!!!..
You would think so wouldn't you LOL

There are people that will try to convince you that population is not a concern.

There are people that will try to convince you that population is in a dire situation right now.

Then there are most of us, who never really seem to think about it much.
We are aware a problem exists but it exist somewhere else, not in my life.

We keep doing what we're doing, not seeing how our little contribution to the problem adds up overall.

The population rate is important yes but what is more important is what that population is doing while it exists, and it exists longer than before.

More people every second of everyday. More being born than dying.
Those people exist by consuming.
Not just food, all sorts of things.

Lets consider food for a sec.
Most foods anymore come in plastic containers or are wrapped in plastic.
Plastic doesn't really degrade normally in the environment.
It has a really long life span.
Sure we could recycle it but how many actually recycle all their plastic?
It gets bought, emptied/used up and the plastic gets thrown away to wind up in landfills or worse yet, our oceans.
Yet we continue to make more plastic and the cycle continues with very little thought of the repercussions.
We know plastic is bad for the environment yet we take no personal responsibility to make a change in the pattern.
We expect others to change our personal habits.
If we didn't buy products with non-recyclable plastic, the manufacturers would stop putting their products in it.
Our consumption drives the problem.
Imagine when there is 10 billion or 15 billion people on the planet.
That's about 1 to 2 generations conservatively.

Look at cities.
People are crammed into cities.
They are so crammed we build vertically to fit more people.
Cities effectively remove nature.
Sure some cities have parks and habitats and want to be green but natural environment is gone.
As more people are alive at the same time, cities will expand both horizontally and vertically.
All those people are existing in a limited space and trying to stay sane.
Look at the landfill waste generated by one major city.
Look at the sewage of one major city.
In 1 or 2 generations it could be doubled.
When people flush their toilets who really thinks about where its going, where it ends up? Yes, but you have to flush twice for it to make it to Trump's office.
Cities have congestion. Traffic, sidewalks, jobs.
Imagine if the number of people were doubled, tripled?
That isn't a maybe, its a reality based on our population rate right now.
What is bad is that its only getting worse as time marches on.

Lots of people think birthrates are the possible fix.
I don't see it that way.

Consider this:
World-wide all mating is limited to 1 child per man-woman mating.
If there are 7 billion of us that is 3.5 billion men and 3.5 billion women that would have 1.75 billion children. This immediately brings the population to 8.75 billion people. At 10 billion, one child per couple means 12.5 billion in population.

Even at 1 child per couple, it is a runaway population explosion.

Now consider that children are being born to younger parents. Those younger parents are living an average of 78 years.
Of those 78 years, some will have more children despite the laws.
All those living persons are going to be using resources and adding to pollution.
Cities will grow, towns will grow.
Real estate that would have been used to grow food will have to be turned into living real estate.
Less room to grow food.
Less room for natural habitats that support wildlife.

Its all only going to get worse as time progresses.
Limiting offspring is an ineffective long term fix.

There are only a few options available to us and as time passes, those options get more and more drastic in order to make a significant change.

Realistically, we don't need to slow population, we need to lower population.
Waiting for a generation to die off naturally isn't working, there's just too many of us.

We also need to be careful because since people do eventually die, any permanent reproduction fix has to be able to be undone.
So, sterilizing the population before it reproduces could eventually wipe us out as a species.

There are ways to cull a population but to make a significant change, that culling would have to be immense and we are talking about thinking beings.

Its immoral to just kill 3.5 billion people. That's the figure right now, in a few years it could be 5 billion or 7 billion.

Some say to start colonizing the oceans.
Good idea for a short term fix but it doesn't solve the population rate problem, it just moves some of the population out of sight out of mind.
Plus, we don't have the technology.

Planetary exodus would work but we don't have the technology to lift, deliver and support 3.5 billion people and again it will soon be 5 billion.

Its staggering to think about it but its happening and few regular people seem to care.
Have you read the threads in the Politics forum?
There's a lot of discussion, debate and whining about everything but what should be important to everyone.

Funny, the most valuable thread I've been searching on the net, I find it in a dating site. All that you've listed, Tom, almost all is already happening in India; (and probably same in China and a few other Asian countries).

We were 0.7 billion in the seventies, we had a family welfare program: 2 kids per family - now we are almost double - over fifty years.

Compulsory Sterilization
In 70s, there was a campaign on compulsory sterilization - coincided with a brief period of Emergency (now infamous). The drive was against the bottom of the pyramid which had the highest growth rate. It is also the largest voter base. Predictably the party lost power in the ensuing elections. Now, no political party wants to touch this area.

Religious Constraint
2000 forward our Prime Minister (economist) theorized that rate would drop as our GDP rose. This surfaced a real problem. The minority religion here has the highest birth rate - and the government cannot take any corrective action since it goes against their religious edicts. The opposition is waiting in the wings.

Thanks Dust4Fun for the outrage; used to think that way but it's like stopping a runaway train; emotions don't work. Anyway, No1PhD's wonderful "calmness under crisis" analysis makes me think that it's high time we made a documentary on what's going on.

Been trying to source a large display that could be hooked to worldometers India section. May be this year.

things that make you go hmm...

Well it seems like a trend for people to become LGBTQ now days, maybe we could make that mandatory for everyone, no more heterosexuals allowed, no more pregnancy, no more births, no more people. These gay's are way ahead of us on this whole thing!

yes, i see the problem...

actually, it should be things that make you go OMG!!!

Still stuck on the reproduction thing, eh?
Try to think beyond the immediate.

The problem is more than a population explosion, if yer not paying attention.
More people means more resources. More resources mean more oil, more wood, more food, more clean water.
Its a diminishing return.

Even if our population numbers were to stop RIGHT NOW we will use up our planet long before it is replenished. But... Our numbers don't stop right now.
They keep growing and growing and nothing is stopping it.
Is there a way to stop it that doesn't involve killing off billions of people?
Your worst case natural disaster kills what, 100,000 people?
100,000 compared to 7,600,000,000. Remember there are 10 100,000 in every million. Then there are 1,000 millions in 1 billion. and there are at least 7 of those.
100,000 isn't anything in the scope of things.
Plus remember that those numbers are growing every second of every day all year long.
We are WAY past concern and almost into OMG.
Yet this is not front page news world-wide?
WTF?

Be it through disease, or famine,
Nature tends to keep checks and balances.

Sounds pretty good, eh?

The main problem is human beings have become adept at circumventing natures culling effects.

We live longer, much longer because we have figured out what is needed for our bodies to be healthier longer.
We recover from natural disasters faster because we have figure out how.
We raise our defects to adulthood because we have learned how to cope with natural handicaps.
The fact is, more people are being born than die at any given moment.
The sad fact is there are more people living longer than ever before.
The natural culling effects of nature have been beaten and can't keep up with our numbers.

If you look at the deathrate of disease or famine or both, it is insignificant to the whole.
I'm not making this up.
If 1,000,000 people die of a disease (when was the last time that happened) there are 7,600,000,000 people as a whole.
For disease and famine combined, to be significant against our current population would require 3,000,000,000 or more to die. That's not even half.

We have progressed to a state in which natural culling is no longer viable.
The ONLY option remaining is if we take it upon ourselves to arrest the trend.

What is hurting our species is the fact that we, as human beings, value life.
We try to preserve life whenever possible and ... succeed.
We value families, children and living to a ripe old age in heath.

What is amazing is that people (in general) don't think about the impact of all us humans on things.
We tend to think in our immediate surroundings.
We complain about the weather, the government and how our lives don't measure up t0 out expectations.

What we fail to see is how things are all connected thru our population density.
If some of us actually acknowldge the problem, most are looking for an immediate fix.

At 7.6 billion people, we are no in a dire situation yet but we have already passed the tipping point.
More people are being born than die.
Those that are living are living longer.
Its a diminishing scenario.
Its global.

Those that think it doesn't effect them right now, right here are deluded.
They're too busy trying to fix blame on the results than pay attention to the cause.

Can't find a job?
Oh, that must be the president.
Forget that there are so many people out there that any job worth having is already taken.
Food cost more, must be the farmers or the truckers, forgetting that more people needing food causes an increase (supply and demand).
Demand is high so the providers raise the prices because it takes time to get it there.
Gas is expensive because more people are using it, driving the prices up.
The US has oil reserves. Oil is all over the planet but it cost more because we have already tapped and depleted the stuff that is easy to get to.
Housing is expensive. Our standards have changed. We 'expect' a better home.
Only so many homes can be built in a given amount of time.
Less homes hit the market because there are more people needing homes.
Rain forests are dissapearing.
More wood is need by more people looking to build something.
Industry that uses wood requires more wood because there are more people wanting what they make.
On top of all this,
You have more people creating more waste for a system that is not able to keep up with it.
So, what do we do? Dump it into the ocean, outa sight outa mind right?
Thing is, its all catching up to us.

Thing is, people don't make the connection of cause and effect.
We are side-tracked.

Pretty adept... That, we are.

Yet, all generations before us, considered
themselves pretty adept.


In 1918, there was an influenza pandemic,
that wiped out 1/3 of the human population.


While one might hope, less likely to occur
in this era. It is still possible, and still plausible,
for another catastrophic pandemic to happen.

Especially, with a booming population, and
fairly convenient world travel.

Actually, nature does NOT "balance" anything. That's a myth, often eagerly adopted and codified by people who want to excuse themselves to continue down a path they already know will be bad for future generations.

It's actually identical to the claim that capitalist economies will "self adjust" and "balance."

That is, specifically, that both nature and unregulated economies WILL react to negative behavior. Just never mindfully, and rarely in a manner that you will enjoy.

There IS no officially correct "balance point" for the "natural world." There's just "the way things are, whatever that is."

If humans become extinct because they cause changes to their own living space that they can't continue living with, that space will NOT naturally return to the way it was before they mucked it up.

Look at small situations we already know about, where human pollution destroyed a given species or made a given location uninhabitable. No extinct species has ever "naturally" sprung back into existence, just because we stopped allowing people to kill it. It stayed extinct, and the rest of the environment "adjusted" to THAT fact, by changing even more in other ways, because that species was gone.

There are only 328 million people in the United States, and we only gain about 2 million a year. The US has plenty of land and resources to continue for a very long time if we do things right. But we better get going on that boarder wall because the longer we put it off the and the worse things get, the more people that will move into our country. Back in the 1800s we relied a lot on whale oil, by the late 1800s we had almost wiped out all the whales except the ones the were really hard to get. Fortunately we discovered petroleum, and electricity wasn't far behind. Then came natural gas, nuclear, solar. Not to mention we've been using water power and wind power for hundreds of years. Power is not a problem for a very, very long time. There has been many times we have almost lost all of our crops, but we have always found ways to combat that. Our biggest problem now is all are crops are Mono crops, we only use things that we have genetically altered, if something goes wrong we could be screwed, however there are many edible species of plans, we may just have to adjust to them. If we would not have genetically altered our crops we would be having an extremely difficult time feeding everyone in the world. Our food prices are currently extreamly low due to technologies, even though people still tend to complain about it. If the population does get wiped out in the next couple hundred years it will probably be from disease, or the hole in the ozone layer creating an environment that is too hot for us to live with, or nuclear enialation or something similar that some nut case comes up with that we currently don't know about. The odds of a meteor or volcanic eruptions taking us out would be like winning the lottery because they usually only happen every hundred million years or so. In other words all you have to fear is fear its self, somethings are best left alone. Have you ever stopped and thought about how big is space? And where does it end? You will never know the answer, so just leave it be.

I do understand what yer saying.
I don't think I stated anything in contrast to that intent.
Nature does find its own balance but sometimes that balance means extinction.
Sometimes the damage done requires long time periods to recover ecologically.
That long time could be 100,000 or millions of years but nature does eventually rebound from ecological change.
If it didn't, the world would have stayed dead after the first ice age or global disaster.
Yes, some natural species will fill the gap.
Mammals filled the gap left by dinosaurs and so on.

The thread intent is about how people (you and me people) are not thinking about a significant issue and prefer to think of immediate issues.
Population rates are not prevalent in social consciousness.

People will ignore the issue until it can no longer be ignored and then, suddenly, everyone will be all for finding a fix, but its already past the tipping point for a humane solution.
All possible solutions from now forward will need to be extreme.
The longer we wait to address the problem, the more extreme the solutions will have to be.
The issue needs focus now, while we can still have a somewhat humane solution.

Yes, the flu pandemic did kill a significant number of people.
Yes, our global presence make any pandemic seriously deadly.
Have to realize that we are aware of that and have plans in place if such an infection were to occur.
The only way that would impact the population is if the fatal infection had a long incubation period.
If it kills too soon, it will be isolated.
If it silently infects, it will saturate a larger portion of the population.
hundreds of millions infected before the problem is identified and protective measures are put into effect.
Then you gotta realize that our medical science are not imbeciles.
One the pathogen is known, a cure will be researched right away.
In population centers, that inoculation can quickly be administered.

So, you need a long gestation period with high fatality that is difficult to render safe.
One of the super-viruses might give us a run for the money but those are under high security and many already have an established inoculation schedule.

However, a natural change in genetic coding might effectively render us extinct. It would be a generational affliction so still not a fix.
Not to give credence to our genetic medical technology.
Chances are, even a genetic change might be averted.