Humanity? Are we on a course to self destruct?
Or will we survive our self absorption?
Some great things are happening to look after the earth and yet some bad things are happening too...

Are we doomed or do we overcome our self destructive ways?
What do you suggest collectively we need to or not do?

everybody seems to want to do the "apocalypse thing". ever notice? Half the movies today are the genre....I really think people wanna bring it about... some even want flesh eating zombies and are actually preparing for it! what the???

idiots.

I actually have what you call a bug-out bag, but only because of all the humans that seem to want this stuff or chaos to unfold...

I seriously would pick up a Sawyer water filter though, because a lot of people are hiding test results in many cities. In New Orleans, it's the absolute first thing to have for survival in this city. It would have saved several hundred folks, ie, my brothers and sisters during Katrina.

Have you ever heard of the Kardashev Scale?

The Kardashev scale is a method of measuring a civilization's level of technological advancement based on the amount of energy they are able to use.

Type 1
Currently, the civilization of Type I is usually defined as one that can harness all the energy that falls on a planet from its parent star, which is about four orders of magnitude higher than the amount presently attained on Earth. So, technologically, by this scale we are a Type 0 civilization.
At our present rate of technological advancement those 4 orders of magnitude could be achieved rather quickly compared to the history it required to reach this point.

As humanity increases its technological levels it is forced to examine new morals unique to those advancements. In other words, as humanity advances we get better at being a civilization.

Look at our recent advances in communication.
We have a better world view of humanity and all its nuances.
However, humanity is new at this.
We are still discovering the moral injustices which were once hidden in obscurity.

As we get a better world view, positive change will occur.
Slow at first but I see humanity finding a moral equilibrium.
I believe that moral equilibrium in humanity will be needed to obtain the final orders of magnitude to bring us into a Type 1 civilization.
In other words, we will work better together as a species worldwide.

Type 2
A civilization capable of harnessing the energy radiated by its own star, capable of using and channeling the entire radiation output of its star.
Right now, humanity is not even close to this but once Type 1 is achieved, Type 2 could happen rather quickly, comparatively.
This is because all the conflict and turmoil we currently endure as a species will have been rectified.

Many people see only a personal view of humanity.
For many, that view is dismal.
Mainly because the significant changes recently require a worldview and people are 'programmed' to have a personal view.
When you impartially look at the advancements in humanity and technology and consider the relationship between the two, it is obvious we are currently morally superior to previous generations.

Tom, you always come up with some interesting, informative reads.

That's because I'm weird.
I don't think like most people or I do but I choose to embrace it rather than hide it.

I'm told I am great to have at a campfire or firepit.
LOL
People really do laugh out loud when you point out the obvious.

There can never be a perfect utopia.
There is always a dystopian element within.
There can never be a perfect dystopia.
There is always a utopian element within.
There can never be a perfectly unified society.
There is always individual turmoil within.

Wealth and Power currently influence humanity.
It is ownership and influence.
One directly affects the other.
Currently, humanity is reactive to this correlation.
This has been the case since history started being recorded.
Many believe it can never change.
What if it did?

What if there was no longer ownership or influence.
At our current technology level we could feed everyone, house everyone, cloth everyone and even provide safe drinking water for everyone.
What stops us?
Money and power.

Remove money and power from the equation and things change substantially.
Some think humanity would stagnate and wither away.
Humans are industrious, creative and intelligent.
Imagine there were no barriers to anyone's creativity.

People will argue nobody would be mining materials or making widgets.
People would invent ways to make it happen.
Possibly a robotic workforce (we are already doing that).
Imagine every person on the planet able to learn, create and explore their interests.
We would see exponential expansion of arts, industry and all sciences including behavioural sciences.
Humanity would not only get more intelligent and industrious, it would get better at being humanity.

You remove ownership and influence and humanity rapidly advances.
At our present level of understanding it isn't happening but at some point, probably right before we unlock Type 1 civilization, it could happen.

We have the technology to have free energy.
We are locked into fossil fuels because the money and power whats to maintain their status quo.
They will fight to keep it.
Remove that element and humanity grows substantially.
I have no idea how that could be done but I do believe, eventually, it will happen.

You see, I have an issue here.
I feel that Communication between the nations are not all that healthy. Collectively, humanity just does not get on very well because of all sorts of reasons, religion, politics, imports, exports, human rights,lack of internet, (China), sexism and a myriad other reasons.
First, we need to humble ourselves, forget our differences and then we can look at unity to actually communicate global interest.
Really interesting post Tom
Thank you

Did your brother's and sisters pass in Katrina?
My brother and sister were driving together in Australia and had a car crash just recently. It made me feel powerless. But love has a way of making you feel scared and vunerable like that
I can't watch zombie stuff, it is so far from reality and I feel it creates a numbness to killing people, which is not normal.

Oh, ha, ha. We posted at the same time.

The communication I am referring to is personal communication resulting in awareness.
Nations isolate us like cultures and societies.
The world is not unified politically but the unification that really matters, shapes our species, is individual worldwide unification.
People shape the national attitudes and as more people connect and get to know others, we unify.

Our worldwide personal communication is just starting to take shape.
People are aware of more cultural differences and how they matter to that group.
People are aware of cultural atrocities against the people of that culture.
We get a chance to personally connect with those people of other cultures.
We learn what is different and what is the same.
We care about other's misery and strife.
We offer help to those we are able to help.
We give our opinions so others may consider alternatives.
Its not prevalent yet but it is starting.

On a personal observation I find the 'person' open to ideas but the 'crowd' is usually lead by one person or group agendas and set to closed mindedness.
The power of change is on a personal level and I see it, even in these forums.
Like humanity is finally taking baby steps. In time we will be walking, then...jumping.

It's about power. Individual vs conformity.
Individuals believe in fair play and corporations within an ethical manner.
Conformist are about forcing others to conform and be mindless drones. This allows those incharge to control and take whatever they want without paying.

If every human on the planet wants a car, and a refrigerator, and clean drinking water, and a job, just western world basics, the pollution and environmental destruction associated with it would finish off most of the planet's life.

Population growth consumerism capitalism has failed.
A new sustainable culture must be adopted, with less manufacturing and more agriculture and re-vegetation.
Limit plastics, and restrict short life consumer goods.
Learn to live in communities again, and share abundance, don't hoard all of it.
Interconnecting networks of local villages, feeding each other their own specialist or niche produce. Like how people used to live.

My small town has a community greenhouse.
It donates fresh produce to schools, shelters and outreach organizations in the community.
It is dependent on money and those in power allocating expenditures.
The courts use it for community service needs.
The schools use it for learning activities.
I personally have never received one benefit from it but I do understand the reason it exists and think it is a great idea.

Something I would love to see happen.
The city, town, municipality, whatever plants fruit trees and berry bushes along the streets, highways and byways.
The town does constant maintenance. Its common to see City of BSL landscaping trucks. They plant palm trees and bushes. Clear overgrowth and maintain ditches and easements.
I think it would be simple to switch to food bearing plants.
I also think anyone with a green thumb should plant food bearing plants.
As a kid, in my home town, I knew where every apple and plum tree was in my neighborhood. I knew where all the berry patches were.

Not everyone wants or needs a car.
The fridge should be standard in all homes.
For the most part, in my country, clean drinking water is not an issue.
Thing is, we already have the technology to make these things available.
If these things are adversely affecting our planet, there are enough people, if educated, supported and encouraged to innovate a better way to provide these things to everyone with less environmental impact.
Money and power prevents us from rising above our current situation.

Remember a few years (decade) back when there was the "One Laptop Per Child" initiative? The idea was to put a $100 internet connected laptop in the hands of every child so every child might have the opportunity to learn.
For a child to reach its potential it needs opportunity, healthy environment, plenty of healthy food and water and encouragement.
As a species, we impede our own humanity.
We impede our own advancement, innovation and industry.
We do this because of the money/power roadblock.

Money and power is so ingrained to most people's understanding of life they are unable to fathom a world where it didn't exist.
If you break down all the stuff we can't do, most of it roots from money or power.

The very fact we can come together during disasters to help one another indicates humanity has the capacity to exist without money or power.
Many people fear we would become lazy. Sure, some people would be lazy but the majority of us like to stay busy. We are an industrious species.
We think
We invent
We build
We make what we build better.
Humanity is rising not falling.

Someone who is complacent has become overly content — the junk-food-eating couch potato might be feeling complacent about his health. The literal meaning of this word's Latin root is "very pleased," but even though complacent people may seem pleased with themselves, we are rarely pleased with them.

During my country's industrial revolution people were driven to a purpose.
A unified purpose.
Our leaders invested money and power to grand innovations.
Mega projects that took decades to complete and supported our families with jobs, industry and community.

The world needs some mega-scale projects to bring world unity.
Long term projects giving security to all people that takes a century or more to complete.
What stops us is money and power.

One example:

Solar panel technology already exists.
Divided highways and highway easements already exist.
Why not line all highways with solar panels?
Not just in 1st world countries, all countries?

Mag-Lev trains exist.
Imagine a project that builds a mag-lev train circuit from Northern Alaska to the Southern tip of Chile With spur loops across each continent.
Imagine the jobs, innovation, industry and community such a project would create.
Then do the same thing from Russia to South Africa.
With existing tunnel/bridge/causeway technology include Australia in the spur loop. If the technology isn't good enough, people will invent and innovate to make it good enough.

Humanity has become complacent.
I believe this is a temporary condition.

I think the Nordic countries are leading the way.

Agreed, the Nordic countries are leading & we should follow their example in many ways.

Yes, we are constantly leaning to destroy ourselves. I do have hope we can get it right. Never a perfect world, but a better world.

I like your thread ideas (((lady)))

I think we need to stop producing about 9 tenths of what we ploduce that serves no other purpose than to make money.
Take a walk down the high street and look in the windows. How much of it is of no practical value.
And of the things that are, How many things dont last very long, and need to be bought again.
how much of what is produced ends up in the bin pretty quickly.

It's wasting finite resources for economic reasons.
The economy, ironicly causes waste.

There's always a new model gadget with more stuff on it.
I use my old mob phones until the old network shuts down, then upgrade.
Car is 1992 model, no cup holder or tinted glass, but works fine.
Printers are made to self destruct in a couple of years.
Things could be made to last longer, and be repaired many times, and upgraded.
Less factories less city jobs, more rural labour work.
Less money for holidays and tourism, so less jobs there too.
Need to change the way we value work time, and types of work.
Developers making millions for swindling, and cleaners making a pittance for their good work. Sports people making millions for playing games, climate scientists getting their funding cut.

Looking at the opening question again...

I believe it is all relative but the relativity is not unique for each person.
In other words, one person may have both a yes and a no answer depending upon what they are considering.

In one sense, yes, we are destroying ourselves.
Change of any kind is a destroyer as it creates something new from something old. Sometimes the change is for the better, sometimes it is not.
In my hometown in the 60s, fewer people had cars, most people used to walk or call a cab. "Town" had all the stores in close proximity (walking distance) to each other. We had a lot of hotels. With three major factories and two smaller factories we had a lot of 'in town' business.

By the late 70s, those three factories closed down. More people owned cars, less people came to my town for business. Stores closed down, hotels closed down, restaurants closed down.
By the early 80s, strip malls started popping up out past the town limits.
More people had cars. Even more businesses closed in town. Walking distance was no longer important.
In the 2000s, a revitalization project was started. New businesses started remodeling the structures in town for a new look, new appeal. Many specialized stores popped up, all within walking distance of each other.
Parks and green-spaces were built.
The 'new town' is much more environmentally friendly than the 'old town' but many prefer the 'old town' because it had a charm or presence the 'new town' lacks.
That presence was the people's familiarity with each other.
In the 'old town' most people knew each other or were willing to stop and talk with someone. In 'new town' people don't usually talk with one another, there is no familiarity. People go there, do what they came to do and go away.

Did we destroy ourselves, some might think so, others may not.
Some might think it is the change we needed to survive in the world.

Innovation is change. Sometimes it change for the better, sometimes change for the worse but from any perspective it can be both.

Then there are those who think we are destroying the planet.
We are not destroying the planet.
The planet will persist no matter what we do.
What we are destroying is 'our' ability to survive on this planet.
For most of the planet's life, it would be deadly to us.
For 4.5 billion years before us, Earth was a hostile environment to humans.
Humans are about 200,000 years old. Our civilization is roughly 20,000 years old. Even if we survive another 800,000 years the Earth will be here another 4 billion or so years.
We are infants stinking up the crib with our poo.
Nothing more.