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Topic: A good start for all

Jonathan83

Sun 02/05/17 06:03 AM

A pregnant woman cross the border.

Has children.
No health insurance and gets welfare.

PROBLEM.

Problem caused by the Constitution. Get it changed, if you can.

No, problem caused by a illegal alien beating our system.. setting out to beat it... and using a kid as a pawn

Exactly. It's upsetting to know that there are many women being promiscuous just because they know can get benefits, or in this case gain access to a country she really doesn't belong in. I have NOTHING against legal immigration. I do, however, feel that there are important issues being neglected because of the immigration problems we are facing.

greeneyes148

Sun 02/05/17 06:13 AM

I don't have to look it up, I know what deception is. you make it sound like they are doing something good.. they are not

When people SET out to deceive.. to get pregnant, knowing that once they are on U.S. soil and have that baby, the Government can do little about that.

And yes.. that is why they got pregnant in the first place... i.e. the pawn.

That is deception and like a prior poster noted.. then the healthcare, welfare and all the rest kick in

But I am sure our new President will put a stop to these loopholes ;)

A few months ago, there was a women on a flight from the Philippines to the U.S. (it was all over the news).. she hide her pregnancy, somehow and boarded a flight. on here expected due date.. and she went into labor close to the U.S.

She tried to hold the kid in.. repeatedly saying.. "Am I in U.S. Airspace yet". She did hold that baby in until she was. then gave birth.

deception.. planned and carried out.

msharmony

Sun 02/05/17 10:07 AM

all of them

laws are enforced upon the discretion of the system

cops are not mandated to stop or arrest anyone breaking a law,, they can choose to warn or ignore it without prosecution

prosecutors are not mandated to try every suspect unless they have the evidence that will be needed to convict

judges can overrule jurors

'deals' can be made for certain crimes in order to pursue bigger crimes

its not a perfect system, it is a system that takes on complex 'crimes'

I feel as far as immigration is concerned, there should be a system that considers intent

those who have knowingly and consentually (children cannot give consent) 'snuck' in should be at the top of those held to the stated immigration consequnces

those who came in as children and made productive lives in the USA should have a choice to become legal within a certain timeframe without being criminalized first,,

imho

details matter

Details for American Citizens.

People who are here that need help I believe we probally help.

If I committ a crime as a parent and go to jail and my children are small they suffer. Many people suffer from crime and being here illegal is a crime. Who's fault is that?

Parents cause thier children to suffer for thier actions all the time. I am not saying thier is not mercy but you need to take care of your own house before you can help anyone.

We have so many problems.

Harboring a known criminal I believe is a crime. Everyone is looking for the American Dream. Trump was voted in it seems because so many feel like the American Dream thier parents, Grand Parents who fought for this Dream for thier families seems to be unreachable.

Many many things I do not like. But I wonder when do we do something and what do we do.

those are good questions

truth is , we have ALWAYS had immigration problems , particularly when they can be used as a 'pawn' for political position

some groups just become targets and pariahs without any logical thought beyond the emotional kneejerk type

children do suffer, but they don't get kicked out of the only country they remember as home

that is why there should be an option for them to become legal, instead of the same consequences as those who intended to deceive when entering,,

TMommy

Sun 02/05/17 10:32 AM

if you are here illegally
tough luck charlie brown and bye bye now

alleoops

Sun 02/05/17 10:33 AM

problem is, those that initiated the deception often become a burden to the system too. "Pawns" is that another way of saying "voters"?

msharmony

Sun 02/05/17 10:44 AM

when they can be used as a VOTER for political position?

nope. doesnt seem to make sense

pawn(miriam webster): one that can be used to further the purposes of another

its similar as gun ownership being used as a pawn, when people just paint all guns and gun ownership in the same light while intentionally ignoring the details and differences from case to case

just saying, 'take all guns' would be crazy, because not all gun owners are dangerous

or just saying 'killing is killing' so that all who kill are jailed, would also be ludicrous,, as details matter when we are looking at someone 'killing' and their intentions/state of mind,,etc,,,

in the illegal immigration debate , all situations are lumped together as equal without logical consideration of the very real differences in details,,,,

alleoops

Sun 02/05/17 11:09 AM

I guess that a fair voter ID system wouldn't make sense to you either. whoa

The real logic and truthful reality is that uncontrolled illegal immigration has put our social welfare and and it's stability at
risk. Too bad there won't be anything left for the majority of
people working today. I guess they are the real "Pawns". sad2

msharmony

Sun 02/05/17 11:21 AM

a fair voter system would be great

I say, automatic registration at 18, tied to having a ssn or documented status

federal consequences for fraud, which is using someone elses identity illegally

the real 'truth' is rarely discussed behind all the cliche soundbytes

the only way for an illegal immigrant to receive welfare is by being FRAUDULENT , which is a prosecutable crime

state by state, immigrants may be paying into taxes more than they are receiving, actually,, but like I said

,,,,details

and does 'people working' include the illegal immigrants working in manual labor jobs that save their legal employers buckets of money ?

Edited by msharmony on Sun 02/05/17 11:23 AM

alleoops

Sun 02/05/17 12:14 PM

I agree, a fair voter system would be great, that, and dipping fingers in purple paint.:)

"does 'people working' include the illegal immigrants working in manual labor jobs that save their legal employers buckets of money ?"

Yes, that's them, and then the employer then uses that money to grow his business and hire more employees. While the illegal worker goes to Walmart or Kroger and send more buckets of money back to where ever. Then, the family in where ever, raise more children so they can come and repeat the same. Throw in some drugs, murder, child trafficking and such, makes for a real safe border situation? slaphead

msharmony

Sun 02/05/17 12:18 PM

the great business owner breaks the law for a noble cause (growing their business)

but the criminal immigrant breaks it JUST to feed their family,,,

,,,,throw in drugs, murder, child trafficking, and that makes for a list of CRIMES that immigrants and civilians are PROSECUTED for,,,

alleoops

Sun 02/05/17 01:11 PM

But the business owner will feed our babies while we send billions in help to those in need. If we take care of ourselves then we will be able to help more. No one is against helping others but there are ways to do it, good way or bad way.

,,,,throw in drugs, murder, child trafficking, and that makes for a list of CRIMES that immigrants and civilians are PROSECUTED for,,,

yep, thats why the criminal illegals head straight to "Sanctuary Cities" too.

greeneyes148

Sun 02/05/17 04:43 PM

but the criminal immigrant breaks it JUST to feed their family,,,

_____________________________________________________________________

It doesn't matter why you committed a crime, the motive rarely ( if ever) plays a part other the to catch the person. So the reason of feeding ones family a non point.. and rarely the case anyway.. more like drugs.. i.e. profit.

And they are not immigrants.. they did not legally immigrate here. So they can not be called something they are not.

they are illegal aliens.. that is what they are.

msharmony

Sun 02/05/17 08:29 PM

immigrant: person who comes to live permanently in a foreign country.

immigrants have many 'legal' statuses

and why you commit a crime does matter, thats why there are so many categories of killing and stealing and so many different potential penalties,,,,

depending upon the DETAILS

Milesoftheusa

Sun 02/05/17 09:34 PM

all of them

laws are enforced upon the discretion of the system

cops are not mandated to stop or arrest anyone breaking a law,, they can choose to warn or ignore it without prosecution

prosecutors are not mandated to try every suspect unless they have the evidence that will be needed to convict

judges can overrule jurors

'deals' can be made for certain crimes in order to pursue bigger crimes

so does that mean send everyone but the children back?

its not a perfect system, it is a system that takes on complex 'crimes'

I feel as far as immigration is concerned, there should be a system that considers intent

those who have knowingly and consentually (children cannot give consent) 'snuck' in should be at the top of those held to the stated immigration consequnces

those who came in as children and made productive lives in the USA should have a choice to become legal within a certain timeframe without being criminalized first,,

imho

details matter

Details for American Citizens.

People who are here that need help I believe we probally help.

If I committ a crime as a parent and go to jail and my children are small they suffer. Many people suffer from crime and being here illegal is a crime. Who's fault is that?

Parents cause thier children to suffer for thier actions all the time. I am not saying thier is not mercy but you need to take care of your own house before you can help anyone.

We have so many problems.

Harboring a known criminal I believe is a crime. Everyone is looking for the American Dream. Trump was voted in it seems because so many feel like the American Dream thier parents, Grand Parents who fought for this Dream for thier families seems to be unreachable.

Many many things I do not like. But I wonder when do we do something and what do we do.

Milesoftheusa

Sun 02/05/17 09:35 PM

Does that mean to send everyone but the children back?

msharmony

Sun 02/05/17 10:52 PM

Does that mean to send everyone but the children back?

no

send those who intended to deceive back

not those who missed a deadline after going through and passing the initial immigration process

and not those who came with no ability to try to deceive due to not being of age to enter into a contract in the first place

Milesoftheusa

Mon 02/06/17 02:33 AM

Does that mean to send everyone but the children back?

From what I know you can not do immigration if you are already in the U. S. So how is missing a deadline when you are with the children not deceiving?

msharmony

Mon 02/06/17 07:53 AM

I dont understand why you believe you cannot 'do' immigration

visas and passports have expiration dates, ,just like drivers licenses

they have to be renewed by a certain date

people forget,

Milesoftheusa

Mon 02/06/17 02:26 PM

visa's and Passports just allow a short stay. Immigration is to come to stay. A visit you have to be able to support yourself. You can not work. Visa's for work or study is another thing. Overstaying your visa or passport is not something you just overlook.

msharmony

Mon 02/06/17 05:43 PM

immigration is coming to stay, but one is still 'undocumented' or 'illegal' if those visas, passports expire

people can overlook many things in a busy hustle.bustle world

Community > Politics, Current News & Events