anything can be 'better than starving to death' relatively speaking, drug dealing, prostituting kids, slavery,,,, et cetera. it doesnt make it any less terrible for kids who have no other choice. It makes it quite deplorable in fact if its done by the threat that they otherwise have to starve.

Being spit on is not as bad as being spit on and SLAPPED, that doesnt suddenly make being spit on a viable and excusable offense.

Id rather have children BEG than be abused and exploited, and all three are OPTIONS, so there is not much excuse to choose the most dehumanizing.

Im for humane and equitable treatment of people ESPECIALLY children.

I dont get frappucinos from Walmart, but I will think of the millions who are employed in honest and humane conditions that can pay their rent, as well as the copouts who say you cant have/support honest and humane without ACCEPTING/supporting the inhumane to get it


when Im shopping at Walmart for other things.

You don't live in a third world country , its easy to criticize when you're in your air conditioned home with food in the fridge, running water and a nice bed to sleep in

Drug dealing eh? you do know what happens to drug dealers when they are caught right?




huh? getting kicked in the nuts with steel toe boots is not as bad as being shot or stabbed in the nuts too, so what is your point?




you rather have children begging for change vs working and earning some money that helps them rather than the measly change they get?

You are heartless.



yes and kids in third world countries are standing in line waiting to pay for their frappuccinos and ice cappuccinos as they ready to go to work in a factory or begging in the streets...oh wait there are no starbucks in those places where they live, as they live in huts, with no running water, their bathroom is an outhouse if they have one.

and if they caught begging by the local police they are beaten because they don't want them near certain tourist place

yes but you want them to beg vs working and earning something that will help their parents pay for food and such.

yeah.

it's all relative.

scum should pay, children should not

scum that harm children to bully them into helping boost their bottom line should pay even more.

And you know they are bullying them how??

You do know that parents that work there also brings their kids right?



Families over there are not receiving any social assistance, tell me you know that at least?

It hasn't been that long since kids here in America, quit school to work on their parents farm. I'm amazed that people don't know our history.

I dont get frappucinos from Walmart, but I will think of the millions who are employed in honest and humane conditions that can pay their rent, as well as the copouts who say you cant have/support honest and humane without ACCEPTING/supporting the inhumane to get it

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Reality check

Wal Mart :
keeps most workers under he hour limit so thy don't have to pay them benefits. There have been horror stories about how Wl Mart treats its workers.

Now lets talk about the other end.. where the crap is made. You remember that I have been to 100's of these factories.. making crap for Wal Mart to buy.

Humane conditions? decent wages?...Lol

It is a horrible life. 12 hours a day, 7 days a week for the minimum amount of pay. The factories are extremely hot, filthy and the basic human needs ( such as bathrooms)do not work in many. Child labor IS used.. as is PRISONER labor. I would know, I caught a few factories do it. Fire suppression systems.. nope.. have fires killed workers in these factories.. yes.

And also, you LIVE where you work. So the workers are cramped into " dorms".. cinder block 5 story buildings on the factory premise. each " dorm" is 10' x 12' and holds 8 people.. No showers.. sponge baths. They eat from the company canteen.. rats, roaches and whatever else the comes in eats there too.

All to give you that cheap price at the register. So, please don't feel like you are doing " the right thing" by buying from WM or any other company that sells this stuff. You not, you are just feeding the wheel.

Honest and humane.. Lol... not.

I dont get frappucinos from Walmart, but I will think of the millions who are employed in honest and humane conditions that can pay their rent, as well as the copouts who say you cant have/support honest and humane without ACCEPTING/supporting the inhumane to get it

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Reality check

Wal Mart :
keeps most workers under he hour limit so thy don't have to pay them benefits. There have been horror stories about how Wl Mart treats its workers.

Now lets talk about the other end.. where the crap is made. You remember that I have been to 100's of these factories.. making crap for Wal Mart to buy.

Humane conditions? decent wages?...Lol

It is a horrible life. 12 hours a day, 7 days a week for the minimum amount of pay. The factories are extremely hot, filthy and the basic human needs ( such as bathrooms)do not work in many. Child labor IS used.. as is PRISONER labor. I would know, I caught a few factories do it. Fire suppression systems.. nope.. have fires killed workers in these factories.. yes.

And also, you LIVE where you work. So the workers are cramped into " dorms".. cinder block 5 story buildings on the factory premise. each " dorm" is 10' x 12' and holds 8 people.. No showers.. sponge baths. They eat from the company canteen.. rats, roaches and whatever else the comes in eats there too.

All to give you that cheap price at the register. So, please don't feel like you are doing " the right thing" by buying from WM or any other company that sells this stuff. You not, you are just feeding the wheel.

Honest and humane.. Lol... not.

I'm not going to lie, I love Wal-Mart. But I've worked in extreme conditions also. I worked at a bakery who sold to Wal-Mart. Working in those ovens without a.c. in the Ga heat is rough. We would work 20 days straight, take 1 day off and work another 20. The difference is I had to go home and take care of 2 kids, cook, do laundry, cut grass, and take care of rental property.

The difference is the job paid pretty well and had great benefits. Great ins, bonuses, they occasionally catered in food, great Christmas parties for adults, separate Christmas parties for our kids with gifts, savings bonds if you weren't absent.

I go off on al Mart at times because I know them from the other side. I have sat in their offices in Bentonville, with their buyers. their buyers would tell us what we will sell the product to them for.. not us tell them. And fact is at those prices the only place it could be made was China and by low quality factories. sweatshops. Good factories would not take the P.O. at those prices.

They would conduct " surprise" social compliance factory audits. ( they have a lot of personnel in mainland China) This is how they appeased the American public that they are not using sweatshops. Problem is they would give us ( and all vendors) 2 weeks notice of the audit visit. They would tell us what day they would be there. And we would make sure the factory was compliant for that one day. no underage..no 12 hour day.. condition in the factory were good. pay books in order ( the other pay books.. the fake ones). It would take all of 2 weeks to clean every thing up. Factory workers were told how to respond to questions ( pay, conditions, amount of hours) so they be asked. If they answered incorrectly, WM auditor would disregard it and ask another person. that one who answered incorrectly was fired by the factory after the audit.

I would at times fly over there to make sure all was in order and that the factories passed the audit. Which they always did.. the next day... back to business as usual.

So on paper and should any entity ask, the factory passed inspection. They could ( and did pull those papers out). Target, Costco, Linens & Things, BJ'S.. doesn't matter, they are all the same. When there was a factory fire or catastrophe and people died ( as there was at times with other factories) the west would raise their moral flag and start yelling.. demanding proper treatment of factory workers. they could just pull out there reports and say " not us.. our factories are just.. fine)

Its all a game.. its all deception... but deep down, we all know this.

I refuse to step foot in Walmart I haven't in maybe 15 years, when my assistant buys our supplies she goes to other places local if possible but never Walmart.

I cant stand walmart, I wouldn't use their bathroom, I don't like what they stand for, the way they treat their people and Im not interested in making their shareholders richer, that is my protest.

That is how us right wingers protest businesses, we refuse to do business with them, we dont burn down their stores or loot.

Easttowest72 mentioned that many people don't know the history of the US and the world well enough, and I want to double down on that.

I've found that it's incredibly rare to find people who have even a relatively basic and accurate understanding of the past, including both the distant past, and the recent past.

Examples include...

that the reason for establishing a public education system was NOT because people wanted to share the high cost of education. Actually, the cost sharing had nothing to do with it. It was the overall benefit to the entirety of the society which drove it, including that the entire nation was made more prosperous, and far more militarily secure and philosophically united because of it.

that people who get rich, don't always do so for the ideal reasons that they are supposed to use to get rich. When someone comes up with a better and cheaper product to compete their way to riches, that's the ideal that most people like to expect has happened. But throughout our history, many people who became rich, especially when they did so in large numbers and very rapidly, it was because the system was rigged in their favor, and too often, not because they produced any REAL wealth at all. Our own most recent near financial collapse, was due to lots of FAKE wealth being created. And during the so-called Golden Age of early industrialism in the US, although some millionaires did things right, many more got to where they did by using the Federal and State government military power to force laborers to accept low pay and poor working conditions.

Then as now, the problem of great wealth disparity wasn't the FACT of it. There's nothing inherently damaging to a society in having very very rich people around. The problem then as now, was HOW the wealth disparity came about, and was maintained.

Riches acquired by buying a company, then breaking it up and selling off the pieces, lowering employee pay and benefits, and/or eliminating safety procedures, doesn't create any real wealth at all. But it has been done many times.

Riches acquired by arranging high pay for upper officers and investors, while running the company into the ground through mismanagement doesn't create any real wealth either.

Buying bad loans and selling them as high quality loans actually destroys real wealth, and was the primary cause of the last downturn.

And of course, riches gained by driving down worker pay, destroys real wealth too.

I don't either.. just because what I know and fact is they " rape" surrounding communities.. them and others

In my town a Wal Mart and Home Depot, Costco opened up. And over a short period of time the " Mom & Pop" stores closed.. one by one. Could not compete. I ran our towns little league and the coaches who volunteers lived and worked here in many at the stores that closed. They took jobs in the city or North Jersey and could not volunteer to coach anymore.. the commute would not allow it. I could not find coaches. I scaled back on the amount of teams in the age leagues.

This was also played out in our towns volunteer fire department, first aid squad, soccer, pee wee football, boy scouts, ect ect.

Wal Mart gives nothing back to the community.. not even sponsoring a little league team. but they strip the towns of their " Mom & Pop" character

My company would pay us overtime to take classes on proper food preparation. For instance carrot cake has nuts and the mixer and pipes should be taken apart and thoroughly cleaned before another type of cake was being made. But the boss had us to purge a little bit of the next cake and skip cleaning. Factories in America do a lot of the same things.

Last I heard the New World Order and the elitists who are attempting to bring it about are getting their *** kicked..As far as they are concerned it looks like it's "back to the drawing board"...

that is a shame. I also know people who worked at Wal Mart(not the factories) and there are millions of them, who are NOT working the conditions you mentioned.

so do I put those workers out of business to start all over on the shitty job hunt because of the factory workers who already have shitty jobs?

It's a vicious cycle that isnt resolved by cutting off the nose to spite the face, but by enforcing policies/laws/rules for the EMPLOYERS to prevent them from underpaying workers and not providing safe conditions.

No doubt it happens here especially in the food industry. You do hear horror stories about beef and chicken. The big difference is that here there is the FDA and checks and balances. There there is not so they do whatever they want. s long as you pay off the right people ( area communist party boss to local " mayor") nobody bothers you.. frankly they don't care as long as they get their money.

One time, a milk factory owner and some of his directors decided to put chemical bleach liquid in the milk.. to make it look whiter. I think it was like 30 children ( maybe more) died from drinking it. They got arrested and put to death but only after a huge outcry from the people.. they were furious. It was a big milk factory and my feeling at the time was that without the outcry they would have got away with it, because they were paying off a lot of people. The Government put them to death.. to shut the people up.

But that is the core mentality there.. you want the milk whiter.. put some chemicals in there.. F.. the children.. you want your stuff cheap.. we will skimp ( or switch) on material.. F the specs.. and F the customer.

I dont want to start off by poisoning the well or sounding cacophonous, but for a guy that claims he is a student of history you are sure cherry picking things.

You are comparing Mercantilism to so called capitalism ?

The system was rigged in mercantilism yes, but not capitalism, for the sake of time Im not going to get into the differences between cronyism and laissez faire, so we shall use the broad term "capitalism" or market economy.





one has nothing to so with the other , wealth created in the golden age fell into two groups, those who did it without government help eg, the Vanderbilts, the Westinghouse's, Rockafeller, J.J.Hill etc, and those that used their government influences like Leland Stanford ,jay gould and jay fisk and Russell Sage as examples.

men like George Westinghouse who treated their employees well and Rockefeller treated his employees fairly, but no one on the left talks about them right?




Wealth disparity has always existed, it first came to light during the great depression and continued on ever since, and of course you forgot to mention before FDR policies came in effect that a lot of these Wealthy people set up huge charities to help the poor, no one talks about that



Igor, mergers and acquisition have been going on in America since 1893, in Finance we call them "waves", it was made into a specialty industry in the 1980's, today we are in the "seventh wave" starting in 2014.
and made possible thanks to government regulations, you forgot to mention that .




that is why corporate governance exists today because of the crap that happened during the Clinton administration and late into George H.W.Bush's administration.



Two different things Igor, and it has nothing to do with the driving workers pay down.Look at the real cause of why workers pay has stagnated.

And why did certain entities sell off bad loans in the first place is the question one should be asking?

While world unity is vital to advancement to a Type 1 Civilization on the Kardeshev Scale, the so-called New World Order is not an attempt to unite humanity.
I have no confidence in the So-Called New World Order in its current or projected manifestations.

?? I never said the American workers were working in the conditions as the Chinese workers are. What I said regarding the American workers is that they are very low paid and WM keeps many under the hour line to be able to avoid offering them benefits. Fact is 70% of Wal Mart workers leave within one year. Safety concerns have also been levied against them.

This is not news,, check for yourself, How WM treats its employees is very well documented.

And from the horses mouth:
___________________________________________________________________
Walmart founder Sam Walton once said, "I pay low wages. I can take advantage of that. We're going to be successful, but the basis is a very low-wage, low-benefit model of employment

Well, it’s true that the oriental world has gained territory and influence over the decades but I’m not all that worried. ISIS has been beaten by a coalition of American-French-German-British troops. I think that the restlessness that occured in the Middle-East in the last 5 years was the result of the Arab revolution in which a lot of dictators like Kaddhafi fell. Dictators knew how to keep structure in their country/regime. Once the regime falls, the structure falls away as well. An exception to this rule is Assad in Syria. Overall, I still think that with the US behind us Europe has nothing to fear. Iran can threaten however much it wants, the US is the country with all the weapons.
So, to answer your question : my balance didn’t change because of the oriental influences. I think that the occidental world is strong enough and that ultimately it will be nuclear weapons that will cause us to succumb as a culture.